Squawk Pod (CNBC Squawk Box) · · 43 min

Attacks in Saudi & Fanatics Goes All-In on Gambling 10/14/26

With Amos Hochstein, Michael Rubin

Summary

Michael Rubin, executive chairman of Fanatics, argued that the company's collectibles and commerce profits are funding an aggressive push into sports betting, where he expects fierce competition from DraftKings, FanDuel, BetMGM, Bet365, Polymarket and Kalshi over the next few years before consolidation and better economics in five to ten years. He said collectibles could reach about $5.5 billion this year, pointing to Deep View patches, a social reach roughly 100 times its 2020 level, and athlete-run stores, and he described a customer ecosystem in which users who enter one business spend about five times more in the original one. Rubin argued Fanatics has no liquidity need and no compelling reason to go public, values the company above $30 billion, and will fight rather than settle the antitrust suits it faces, most of which have been dismissed. Amos Hochstein separately argued that a slow economic embargo on Iran is a weak strategy, that sanctions should be used to win a nuclear deal and Strait of Hormuz navigation rights as in the Obama era, that energy prices will stay high because of tanker attacks and soaring freight costs, and that US military munitions stocks are thin and the US failed to respond to Houthi advances into Saudi Arabia.

Key takeaways

  • Amos Hochstein on US global standing & alliances: The US sat out the Houthi advance, failing to deter it despite Saudi requests for help.
  • Amos Hochstein on Middle East & Iran: Waiting for Iran's economy to collapse under an embargo is a bad strategy; the regime won't fall soon.
  • Amos Hochstein on Oil & fuels: Energy prices won't come down while Hormuz tanker attacks continue; the futures price is detached from reality.
  • Amos Hochstein on Middle East & Iran: Trump should negotiate with Iran on nuclear limits and Hormuz navigation, lifting sanctions as Obama did.
  • Michael Rubin on Sports, betting & prediction markets: US betting marketing spend will rise from about $3B to roughly $7B next year.

What was said, by company and theme

6 views from 2 speakers. Every quote is checked against the episode's transcript (how).

Middle East & Iran

  • Amos Hochstein · TWG Global

    Waiting for Iran's economy to collapse under an embargo is a bad strategy; the regime won't fall soon.

    Hochstein says the embargo is the patient approach that waits for the Iranian economy to collapse. He estimates that would take six to twelve months, and he argues the regime will not collapse anytime soon even under extreme economic stress. Meanwhile, Iran's proxies keep acting: Houthi attacks, Shia militias in southern Iraq, and tanker strikes. Status quo is not a stable option because the situation keeps changing. He therefore thinks waiting is a bad strategy.

    “It would take a very long time, six months, nine months, twelve months. The Iranian regime is not gonna collapse anytime soon even under these extreme economic issues.”at 19:36
  • Amos Hochstein · TWG Global

    Trump should negotiate with Iran on nuclear limits and Hormuz navigation, lifting sanctions as Obama did.

    Hochstein argues the economic pressure should be aimed at getting a deal rather than at collapse. The first priority is restoring agreed limits on weapons-grade nuclear material. The second is freedom of navigation through the Strait of Hormuz, and the US should take as much of that as it can. He cites his time running Obama-era Iran oil sanctions, when sanctions were used to bring Iran to the table, and then they were lifted after a deal. He thinks Trump should do the same.

    “The point was not sanctions for sanctions sake. It was to... The Iranians didn't wanna come to the table. We did the sanctions effectively. They came to the table. We did a deal. We lifted them. I think that's what he's gotta do here.”at 24:18

US global standing & alliances

  • Amos Hochstein · TWG Global

    The US sat out the Houthi advance, failing to deter it despite Saudi requests for help.

    Hochstein says there was no US reaction when the Houthis advanced into Saudi Arabia and took over the Bab el-Mandeb Strait a few weeks earlier. Normally, US presence in the region would have deterred and stopped that advance. He calls it an uncomplicated advance by a not very sophisticated military. Previous administrations, from Obama through Trump to Biden, kept the Houthis contained. He says the US sat it out even though Saudi Arabia asked for help. He cannot understand why.

    “there was no US reaction. The United States normally would have used its presence in the region to deter and to stop that advance.”at 17:31

Defense

  • Amos Hochstein · TWG Global

    US munitions can't be ramped up meaningfully within months, and stockpiles are strained by several wars.

    Hochstein says US military planning for the last decade and a half did not account for supplying Ukraine for four years, aiding Israel, and fighting two wars against Iran that used large amounts of munitions without a resupply chain behind them. He doubts the US is running out of munitions for current operations. He argues that any further escalation would require more munitions. A two-, three- or four-month production ramp-up is not a meaningful increase in supply.

    “the ramp up, you're talking about a two month, three month, four month, that's not a meaningful ramp up of supply.”at 21:30

Oil & fuels

  • Amos Hochstein · TWG Global

    Energy prices won't come down while Hormuz tanker attacks continue; the futures price is detached from reality.

    Hochstein says energy prices are not going down. He argues the quoted price is a futures contract that does not reflect the physical market. Tankers are being hit daily and nightly, with casualties, so some shipping companies are refusing to sail. Freight costs have soared, with shipping costs reported at about $1.4 million per voyage versus about $100,000 before. That raises the cost of moving oil and keeps physical prices high.

    “And by the way, the energy prices are not going down. ... The price on the screen is a futures contract that is detached from reality.”at 21:55

Sports, betting & prediction markets

  • Michael Rubin · Fanatics

    US betting marketing spend will rise from about $3B to roughly $7B next year.

    Rubin estimates that about $3 billion was spent on US betting and gaming last year, and expects about $7 billion on marketing next year. He says the market is extremely competitive, with five major players competing for customers. He frames the figure as a bet, so it is an estimate rather than a company guidance number.

    “There were probably $3,000,000,000 spent in US betting and gaming last year. I bet you there'd be $7,000,000,000 spent in marketing next year.”at 30:28

Topics

  • Fanatics IPO timing
  • Iran economic pressure strategy
  • Iran nuclear deal and sanctions
  • US response to Houthi offensive
  • antitrust litigation against Fanatics
  • betting marketing spend
  • collectibles business growth
  • collectibles demand
  • cross-business customer ecosystem
  • munitions supply and resupply
  • oil prices outlook
  • prediction markets age limits
  • sports betting competition and marketing
  • sports betting investment funding
  • sports betting profitability

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